The Fight to Save Weightlifting (with Sarah Davies)

The current executive board do not like me on that commission. Fact. They didn’t like that I was appointed in the first place, despite the fact that they approve that athletes commission and all the names that were on it.

They have to approve it because they’re the executive board. Yet they tell me every day how I shouldn’t have been appointed, and this and that and the other. Yeah.

Wait. They’ve told you that? People on the executive board have told you that specifically?

Yeah. [laughs]

Welcome to the “BarBend Podcast” where we talk to the smartest athletes, coaches, and minds from around the world of strength. I’m your host, David Thomas Tao, and this podcast is presented by barbend.com.

Today I’m talking to British weightlifter Sarah Davies, who represents England at the highest levels of international competition. The 2018 Commonwealth Games silver medalist is also the IWF Athlete Commission’s chair, a role that sees her advocating for athlete representation within the sport’s international governing body.

Over the past year, massive shakeups, corruption allegations, and doping scandals have rocked the International Weightlifting Federation. Sarah has been very outspoken about where she feels the IWF must undergo reform, a stance that has created tension between her and members of the organization’s executive board.

In this episode, Sarah joins us to talk about how weightlifting needs to change, her candid experiences as the Athlete Commission chair, and how she balances her dual role as athlete and advocate.

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Sarah, thanks so much for joining us today. To give people context for the work you’ve been doing not only as a weightlifter but off the platform, it’s important to talk about what’s happened in the last year, year and a half of weightlifting.

Last year, the timeline runs together with the pandemic sometimes, you were named a member of the first IWF Athletes Commission. Tell us a little about that process and the work that you have been doing in that role, if you don’t mind.

I applied for the Athletes Commission the summertime last year, to be on it, full stop. Then the email came through to all applicants who had applied. The way it works is you get a male and female per continent. I was reading through and I was like, “Oh, my name’s not on the list.”

For Europe, we’ve got Jurgen from Germany and then Dora from France. I was like, “Oh, I didn’t make it.” Then I’m reading down, and I was like, “The chair of the commission is Sarah Davis from Great Britain.” I was like, “Oh.”

That got real because there are some big name athletes on that commission. You’ve got Lu Xiaojun on there. You’ve got some big names. I was like, “Oh, I’m in charge. How did that happen?”

That was in September. At the time, we still had Ursula Papandrea as interim president. That was part of her project as president, to have the athlete voice. Obviously, as an athlete herself, it was a big thing for her to have that voice heard.

I got thrown in the deep end because the Athlete Commission was created and then all hell broke loose. The executive board removed Ursula as president. She was mentoring me through it, to be in that role and stuff, and then suddenly that was removed. Suddenly, I was thrown in with the sharks on my own and no cage around me to protect me, I guess.

It’s been cool. The Athletes Commission was Ursula’s baby, but also the IOC had requested that there was more athlete voice within the organization.

The IOC rules are that each governing body, international federation, has to have athlete representation on their board. The rules are to have 20 percent of their board members, voting members, to be athletes. We’re not at that yet, but that is the goal moving forward. It’s been a busy few months in my first position as chair, to say the least.

It’s been interesting because you were made as head of this commission, which is very cool to see. Then very shortly thereafter, it seemed like, as you said, all hell broke loose at the IWF. Leadership completely flipped on its head, there was, many people called it, a coup from within.

You’re still in this position, but you’ve been very outspoken and very critical — we’re recording this in February 2021 — of current IWF leadership, the leadership that was involved in Ursula’s ouster.

Is it awkward at all being so heavily involved in the IWF and then being so critical? Obviously it’s going to be little bit awkward, but how has your role changed at all, or your day-to-day in that role changed?

In some ways the whole pandemic has made it a bit easier because everything’s been behind a screen. We all know there’s keyboard warriors on the Internet.

I’m a bit of a low-key keyboard warrior, because I can sit on a Zoom call for the executive board meeting and there’s nothing they can do. Whereas, I think with an in-person executive board meeting, it might be more difficult and to be in competitions and stuff like that. It’s certainly been interesting.

The initial video that went viral in terms of weightlifting was when they removed Ursula and replaced her with Intarat from Thailand who were serving a nation ban. It was one of those things I was irate about it and I was like, “Do you know what? I just need to get my words out

I would have done it regardless, but the position that I was in made it blow up a lot more than it was because I was Chair of the Commission and therefore all the attention that came with it.

The current executive board do not like me on that commission. Fact. They didn’t like that I was appointed in the first place, despite the fact that they approve that athletes commission and all the names that were on it.

They have to approve it because they’re the executive board. Yet they tell me every day how I shouldn’t have been appointed, and this and that and the other. Yeah.

Wait. They’ve told you that? People on the executive board have told you that specifically?

Yeah. [laughs]

That’s just very…I don’t know. I have this image in my head of sports governance being very polite.

Oh, no. [laughs]

It doesn’t seem like that’s the case right now.

Not at all, especially in weightlifting. Our executive board is 20 people, and only one of them now is female, and then myself. There was Ursula as well. The way that they speak to female members of the Commission is outrageous.

They are the epitome of male chauvinists. They don’t speak to each other like that. They only speak to women like that. The way that they speak to me, if that was a normal business or organization you’d have a full Human Resources thing, a whole disciplinary act going in, but we don’t have that set up. We don’t have that ability within the organization.

I’ve spoken to some of my friends that work in that department in regular businesses, and they’re like, “You’d have a full scale disciplinary investigation, people losing jobs, all sorts of stuff if that was…” There’s nowhere to turn for it, which is the frustrating thing.

I’m fortunate that the IOC have worked really closely with me. They’ve been really supportive and are doing everything they can. Also here in the UK, our governance for sport in the UK have been supportive in whatever they can do to help me. I am thankful that I am getting help, but there’s nothing…

There’s two people on the executive board that appreciate me being there, and that I trust in that executive board. If it wasn’t for the IOC having such a big push on athlete representation, the executive board would have got rid of the whole Athletes’ Commission by now.

They don’t want us there. They don’t care about the athletes’ opinions or views because they’re just going to do what they want to do, which is frustrating. Some of those executive board meetings go on for 11 hours and, of course, you’re working across multiple time zones.

Sometimes I can’t attend it for the whole thing. It’s just not possible. I remember being dialled into one. It started at 7:00 PM, UK time and they went on till 3:00, 4:00 in the morning. It got to one o’clock and I was like, “Nah, I’m out. [laughs] I’m going to bed.”

Because at the end of the day, I’m still a current athlete. That’s what I need to remind myself. It’s what my coaches have been saying, “What you’re doing is important, but also your career is just as important because you only get your chance to do your career now.”

The role is difficult, and it’s added a lot of stress. I’m also aware that I need to take that stress, because otherwise we don’t have a Paris Olympics. That’s the reality of it. It’s taken a lot of my time, but if I don’t do this, and I don’t have another Olympic Games to train for. It’s Catch-22.

We’ll get back to the conversation in just a moment, but first a quick shout out to our episode sponsor, Athletic Greens. Athletic Greens is the daily all-in-one supplement with vitamins, minerals, probiotics, adaptogens, and more, to help your body perform at the highest level.

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Well, the IOC, the International Olympic Committee, has made very clear that weightlifting is in the doghouse, so to speak. They dramatically reduced athlete quotas for the 2024 Olympics, for the Paris Olympics.

There are some who say that weightlifting’s inclusion at Paris and even beyond Paris is tenuous at best. What do you think needs to change in the sport for weightlifting to have a more secure future in Olympic sport?

We need to see a complete change in the current executive board. The problem is the current executive board were all present for multiple years of Tamás Aján’s reign over weightlifting and all the corruption that went with it.

He’s not there anymore, but they’re still very much an old boys club. They’re all still basically running the same regime. They think that the IOC can’t see that, but the IOC aren’t deaf. They can see right through the smoke and mirrors and everything else.

We need the executive board to just go. We need the Congress and the constitution to change as well in line with that so that we just get a complete restart of the whole sport. Literally hit the reset button and start again with a not new organization in the sense of like to split from the organization. I don’t think that’s what our sport needs.

We just need a complete revamp so that we go in with fresh new people, people that are under the age of 70. I don’t think most of the executive board are under 70. [laughs] We need people who are willing to move this sport forwards into 21st century and keep going from there.

I don’t know the answer completely, but that’s definitely a huge push because the IOC are watching closely, like we’re fully under the microscope. That’ll be a start. Then obviously, from there, if you get a new executive board, then the anti-doping rules and all that kind of stuff, and the athlete representation will come with it. Under the current leadership, we won’t get that.

What kind of support has the IOC given you? You said they’ve been very supportive. Is there any particular department at the IOC that is helping you with resources or being a sounding board for your voice and the other athletes’ voice on the Athlete Commission?

Yes. Generally, they’re a good sounding board. You’ve got Kit McConnell. I don’t know his official title, but he’s like director of sport for the Olympic Committee or something. He’s important anyway.

It sounds like a big title.

It’s something like that. He’s important. I’ve got a direct line to him if I need something. If I want to tell the IOC something, I can write them an email or a letter. It goes through to them that way, and to have my view and the view of the athletes put forward.

It’s almost like a safety net. I know I can go to the IOC with these issues. It won’t affect me or my selection or any of my competitions because they’ve got me protected.

I also have a liaison from the IOC Athletes’ Commission. They have their own athletes’ commission. I’ve got almost like a mentor from there. I’ve got Danka, who’s been on the IOC Athlete Commission. She helps me. It’s like that bit of a sounding board.

At the end of day, there’s only so much the IOC can do. They only have rule over the IWF in terms of Olympics, not as a whole. They can say like, “If you don’t do this, then we’ll remove from the Olympics.” Obviously, that doesn’t affect world championships, continental championships, all of that kind of stuff.

They do listen to the athletes. They want to know what’s going on, how we feel about it, and all that kind of stuff. I am thankful for that, that they are supportive but, like I said, they can only do so much. If the IWF choose not to listen, then that’s their doing, I guess.

What are some of the policies of the current IWF executive board that you think are antiquated and that need to be thrown out the window?

I wouldn’t say it’s necessarily like policies and stuff, but just the people. They’ve been there for a long time during all the corruption, and they still think like,” Oh, yeah, but I know this person at the IOC. I know that person. They said that they can sort us out,” which I think has happened previously.

Weightlifting’s been threatened to be banned from the Olympics for longer than I’ve been lifting, by the sounds of it. They’ve gotten away with it before because they’ve known people or whatever else.

That’s part of the problem. It’s very much, “I know this person. I know that person.” They still think that they can give backhanded money deals and all of that kind of stuff, and that it will get them around it. There’s some of the issues like the constitution, the policies around like the anti-doping stuff that they’re trying to change.

They wanted to change the Olympic selection and policies. There’s people on the executive board who have a conflict of interest because they’re coaches of athletes, or they’re well-involved in their own national federations that they want [indecipherable 15:29] .

Nations, for example, that are on multiple bans and will, therefore, facing a ban from the Olympics. They wanted to change the Olympic policy so that those previous bans didn’t count. The Olympic policy started again post-corona. It’s just not possible.

A few of the policies that have been put in place are moving us forward but not at the pace we need it to. Signing the deal with the ITA, the International Testing Agency, is a positive move, but it’s just not enough. It’s a problem.

What are some of the policies that you think could be sped along? What is the pace that we need to move at when it comes to things like anti-doping rules, for example?

Part of the problem of anti-doping was obviously it falls under each national federation out of competition. A lot of these countries have got problems bigger than just weightlifting. You look into the whole Russian stuff and the Icarus documentary. They’ve got national programs.

It’s not necessarily the IWF. The ITA can only do so much testing. They’ve only got so much resources. The whole thing around, they tried to change it so that it went from three anti-doping rule violations to four that triggered a nation ban. I’m like, “But if you’re doing your job properly at home, you shouldn’t be getting any bans on an international stage.”

I can’t speak for everybody else, but I know for me and German and Western Europe, we get tested before every major competition at home, because then you’re not going to get a fine and you’re not going to run the risk of a ban or whatever. Our national federation makes sure we’re tested multiple times at home.

If the national federations were doing that, it could be one international test and your nation gets banned. Do you know what I mean? It could be that strict, because if you’re doing your job properly at home, it shouldn’t be a problem. That is the extreme.

The whole thing of them trying to move it to four, that was completely unnecessary. It could be as tight as two, in my opinion. If it’s done right at home, then it’s done right at home.

The other thing that we need, currently coming up, we’ve got the Electoral Congress to appoint a new executive board in March and then the Constitutional Congress later in the year. In reality, it needs to be the other way around.

The way it currently stands is the executive board could get revoted back in under the current constitution because the rules are there. One of the current rules in the constitution is you can be on the executive board as long as you’ve not served an anti-doping violation yourself in the last 10 years.

We shouldn’t have anyone on the executive board that served a doping violation of any capacity in their lifetime, in my opinion. If your nation is on a nation ban, you should lose your spot on the executive board. You should automatically have to step down.

I think we need stuff like that going on that will make these nations who do have national doping programs actually go. “There’s a lot of risk if we do this.”

If you lose your technical officials at internationals, if you lose your executive board players, your players on commissions, then I think they’ll be like, “OK. Let’s actually take check.” The punishments need to be harsher.

It doesn’t need to be a case of having a fine or a 12-month ban. It needs to be you lose all rights and you can’t even step in the room of a weightlifting competition on an international level if you’re from that nation. That’s a way we need to go around it.

The ordering of the constitutional convention and the executive board election, that was something that you were very vocal about online, saying, “No. We need to have the constitutional convention first.”

Tell us a little bit more about why that specifically is, and what the constitutional convention is because it’s more than the IWF Executive Board involved with that.

Yeah. The Constitutional Congress is when all the rules and regulations and everything that is involved in weightlifting. Under that jurisdiction comes how the executive board is selected.

Which is why, in my opinion, and the IOC, have said that the constitutional congress needs to come first. Then how we elect our executive board and our commissions comes under the new one with the new rules that say, “You can’t have done x, y, and z, and this, that, and the other.” It’s a lot stricter, and this is how we’re going to move forward as a sport.

Whereas the current constitution has allowed all of these loopholes and everything to happen that’s all come to light over the last however many years. All of those problems have happened under that current constitution, so we need a complete revamp of it.

There needs to be things like athlete representation in there. They say that they want the athletes to have a vote on the board, but there’s no athletes’ voices up there for the executive board elections because under the current constitution, athletes don’t have a vote.

Yet, one of the IOC things is that athletes need to have a 20 percent vote on the executive board. Then they want to change the constitution and whatever else.

I actually said it in the board meeting today, the IWF has bent the rules for the last 40 years and you’re choosing now to follow the rules to go, “But our constitution says we have to do this, and then do that after.”

I’m like, “You’ve made it work before in your own benefit. For once, do it in the benefit of the sport and bend the rules again.” The amount of times they’ve got around stuff, I’m like, “You’ve got around stuff for terrible things before.” Money, everything that’s gone missing, and all this kind of stuff.

We need a complete reset and you’re choosing to go, “Oh, no. Our current moves don’t allow for that.” It’s madness.

It’s not just a little bit of money they’ve lost before in the couch cushions, it’s well over US$10 million over the course of a few decades. It might be more because honestly…

That’s all we know about.

That’s all we know about. The answer is that’s the corruption that is beyond a reasonable doubt that that money was misplaced or misappropriated or taken.

 It [indecipherable 21:29] Mr. Tamás Aján’s house can tell you where that money’s gone. [laughs]

If $10 million is what we know is missing, it stands to reason that there might be more or there might have been more going on, because Tamás Aján’s reign was not just a few years. It was not a presidential term of four years, like a lot of Americans might be used to, or eight years.

He was at the top of the IWF governance for four decades, going back to the 1970s basically.

That’s another thing we need. We need to have terms on the end of the executive board because most of the executive board members have been there for 20 years as well. We need to have terms, and you serve a term, and then you can’t reapply unless it’s for a general secretary or for president if you’ve been an executive board member we need to have.

That all again comes under the current constitution versus what we need for the new constitution. That’s the stuff we know about. Then you’ve got drug tests going missing, and all of that kind of stuff. Samples that never got tested. The list goes on, and you think that all of these people that have been involved are still sat there in charge of our sport, and that’s the problem.

Yeah, I didn’t even mention the drug tests that had gone missing. I didn’t mention the admitted and largely proven bribes at multiple executive board elections. I didn’t even get to say that because the figure that stands out in my mind is how much money is missing.

Weightlifting is not a sport that a lot of people associate as being neck deep in extra cash. This is not the international popularity of football. This is not the international popularity of gymnastics. It’s a relatively small niche sport.

That gargantuan amount of money represents quite a bit of the money that weightlifting brings in at the international level. Then you get into repeated doping violations, cover ups, and the fairly blatant bribery for board elections, actually people exchanging money for votes.

They’re pushing at the minute as well to have in-person elections against the executive board so that can happen. They can sit in the bar and drink together and go, “Go on, vote for me,” and this and that, when it needs to be done online. Whether we can even be in person is looking slim at the minute.

These elections had been pushed back twice already. They should have been late last year. They should have been after Tokyo with its original date. They’ve been pushed back again because they’re pushing for it to be in person so that those things can still go on. That’s what makes it so ridiculous.

What is your communication like with the other members of the Athletes’ Commission?

It’s good. It’s like any athletes’ commission, you get some people who are more active than others in that kind of stuff. That’s just generally athletes in general when it comes to replying to emails and other bits and pieces…

I know all about that from the [indecipherable 24:37] .

[laughs] Generally, it’s good. A few of the athletes I already knew in more of a personal level anyway, from competitions and stuff. It’s good to have that and that support.

Especially like I pushed hard the other day too when the IOC were present at the executive board meeting. I pushed to have the athletes present, the whole of the Athletes’ Commission, because it was such an important meeting. Originally, I was told no. I went around that IWF into the IOC, and then got the athletes on the meeting, which was good.

Obviously, we weren’t in a room, but to be able to see their faces on the screen of these people that are friends of mine and people that I know support me and my cause, that in itself helped me be even more outspoken in that meeting than maybe I have been previously.

The messages that I got from some of the athletes afterwards was, “Is that what every meeting’s like for you?” I was like, “That was tame because you were all present.” They were like, “They speak to you like that?” I was like, “Yes.” [laughs] It’s crazy.

Generally the commission are really helpful and speak up. There’s some athletes on there who were still scared to speak up because of the effect that that would have on them and their selection with people that are on the executive board and the powers that they have within their continentals or their national federations.

Which is scary, that these people have that kind of power over athletes that they can’t have a free voice because they think it’ll affect their selection.

I’ve been really fortunate that British weightlifting has backed me the whole way with it. I’ve had my ups and downs in my national federation before when it comes to selection and stuff like that, and the way they go around things. I’ve actually been proud to be a British weightlifting athlete, because they have backed me and they’ve stuck to their word.

They’ve been quite public as well with everything that’s going on and how they feel about the executive board. There’s a few nations have been like that, but there’s also a lot of nations who have the executive board involved in their own member federations. They’re stuck to speak out, which is a shame. Even though they can’t speak out, I know they support me. It’s not too bad, I guess.

I have to ask how your training is going because as you mentioned earlier, you’re still very much in the prime of your career. You’re juggling a lot of different responsibilities in the weightlifting world. How is training been going for you and prep for 2021 — we’re into 2021 now, but you know what I mean — how’s that been going?

It’s been kind of mixed, like having nothing to work towards is difficult. We had a little mini online nationals the other day. We had the English championships, but we did it in the gym. I wasn’t happy, I only got my openers, and I couldn’t get myself in that competition mindset because I was still in the gym.

I’m very much a competition lifter rather than training lifter. My big lifts come in comp with the adrenaline with the crowd and everything like that.

I’ve made a lot of good technical changes. The way Olympic qualification works is we had so many competitions back to back that you couldn’t really take that time to do volume training or to do the technical work. You had to be in peak fitness the whole time.

It’s been good to do all that kind of stuff and spend that time doing the technical work and everything. I could see from my lifts at the weekend, even though I wasn’t happy with how they went in terms of numbers, the technique is so much more solid than it was this time last year. I’m kind of thankful.

Who knows what’s going on with the Continental championships in April. The Oceania just got postponed back to August. I think that might mean that therefore the Continentals don’t count for Olympic qualification. I don’t know. I don’t take my word for that.

The Europeans look they’re likely to go ahead. I think even if they’re not a qualification competition, if we can go, we will get sent because we need platform time.

The last time I competed, it was the Robot World Cup. What’s that now, 13 months ago? It’s a long time to be off a platform. You don’t want the first time you back on a platform to be when you’re on the Olympic platform because that will be whole kinds of nervous.

Training is going well. I can’t complain. I’ve stayed fit through lockdown. I’m healthy. That’s all you can ask for. Making technical changes and hopefully, it will all pay off on the platform and when it matters.

Awesome. Sarah, thanks so much for joining us and talking about issues. All big issues. I was going to say issues big and small, but we didn’t talk about it. We had no small questions today. I appreciate you working with me through all of those.

Where is the best place for people to follow along with you on social media or any other outlets?

My big thing is Instagram. It’s @sarahd_gb. You’ll find me there.

Easy enough. Thank you so much for joining us. Appreciate it and looking forward to seeing you hopefully step back on the competition platform before too long.

Yes. Thank you for having me.